S/O: Do you think free public ed. 1-12 is a right that should be available to all?

[Phred]

If you do feel that public education should be free and available to all for grades 1-12, why? Or why not?

How/why is the 1-12 education "right" different from the "right" to say, a college ed. or even health care? Can/will you define why one may be is a right and one may not be?

Does a practice eventually become considered a "right" by the majority because it has been in place for X # of years? Does tradition = a right?

I'm trying to distinguish between and define for myself what is

a right,

a responsibility (came up in debate last night, though I was unclear as to whose responsibility they meant),

and a privilege

within a democratic and capitalist system.

thanks for sharing your ideas!

[Phred]

My thoughts.

Education is a double-edged sword in this country. On one hand we provide it to lift up those who will benefit from it so that they can go on to college and become the engineers, scientists and leaders of tomorrow. It is in our best interests to provide this education for them, free of charge, as it benefits us all when they discover new cures for diseases, things like computers and internal combustion engines... stuff that drives our economy.

On the other hand we also provide this education so that the kids who might not benefit from it will be kept someplace during daylight hours rather than stealing my TV. It's sort of a deal we've struck with the people that tax us. I pay them and they keep all the kids in school and out of my living room. Is that a pessimistic way to look at things... sure. Is it realistic... that too.

What people are bitching and complaining about is that they don't like it that their kids are in the same buildings with the other kids. They don't want their budding geniuses in the high schools with the budding drug dealers. I hear ya... I don't want my kids there either. But if we move all the kids out of the high schools whose parents think they're little Einsteins the buildings will be empty and all the kids will be in the other facility. You're not going to fix this problem without breaking some eggs... and some hearts.

Other countries have managed to whip their education systems into line... but those countries don't have a permanent lower class. They'll find out though as they're getting a Muslim influx that's causing the crime rates to go up and the educational systems to stress. I'm far from prejudiced but what's happening in England and Denmark is sickening and it's directly tied to the influx of poor Muslim immigrants who don't wish to "melt" into the society but wish to maintain their own ways and traditions. We'll see how long they can maintain their standards of excellence when the schools have to deal with this drain on their resources.

So what to do? We don't have a choice but to continue to offer public education and we can't underfund it any more than we are... letting parents yank their kids and dollars out doesn't help... and it may not help the kids. These "charter schools" aren't always so good either. Not compared to a homeschool.

We need to first fix poverty... and that's a hell of a mountain to climb.

[Hot Lips]

Ah, man... you want us to discuss serious subjects and not just post provocative pictures? OK, I don't think an education is a right, but... and this is a big BUT, a society that is just, would want to have an educated populous. I'm all for choice (all sorts of choice), and I wish we in the US, do what they do in some European countries, and have the money follow the kid. Yes, the US is huge and it would take time to improve the schools to choose from, but I think it would happen.

[Jesus]

I think all people have a 'right' to knowledge- I don't believe any one person or entity should "own" knowledge. Knowledge is for all, it's there for all IF they have the funds to purchase it. Blech. I think that we either have rights to everything, or we have absolutely no rights to anything. Either all the resources in the world are here for all those who inhabit the world to use, OR none of us have any right to any of the resources in this world because we did not create those resources (and I'm talking about from 'the beginning' here- I'm not talking about Bill Gates' rights to Microsoft and such as that- but rather our rights to the raw materials from which all things have come into being).

[antonia]

My answer to all of the above is... Jesus! Sorry, I will try to formulate an intelligent reply after I've got over this mofo'ing headcold.